You origins (2nd person pronoun): Difference between revisions

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Origins of the 2nd person pronoun "you"
Origins and predecessors of the 2nd person pronoun "you" and "yours"
* ''thee, thou, thy, thine, ye''
* ''thee, thou, thine, thy, ye''
* useful for Shakespeare "you" translations
* these "you" forms are from "Middle English"
** useful for Shakespeare "you" translations
* "you" and "your/yours" replaced them into the 1600s
** however, Shakespearean and Biblical texts have traditionally maintained "thee" / "thine"


== "You" origins ==
== "You" origins ==


* Old English origin of "you"
* Old English origin of "you"
** from Old English "''thou''" (dative and accusative cases)
** from Old English "''thou''" and "''ge''"
** or "''ye''" (objective case)
** or "''ye''" (objective case)
* [[PIE proto-Indo-European language|PIE]] origin of "you"
* [[PIE proto-Indo-European language|PIE]] origin of "you" and "thou"
** second person singular: '''*tege-''' (from which "''thou''" and "''tu''" are derived)
** ''you'' is from second person plural: '''*yu'''
** second person plural: '''*yu'''
** ''thou'' is from second person singular: '''*tege-''' (from which the French and Spanish "''tu''" is derived)
* transition from "thee" to "you"
* transition from "thee" to "you"
** in Middle English, the second person plural form merged with the singular
** in Middle English, the second person plural form merged with the singular
*** 2nd person plural was original used for both plural "you" and out of respect to a superior "(thy")
*** 2nd person plural was original used for both plural "you" and out of respect to a superior "(thy")
*** 2nd person plural came to be used to show equal status, thus as a courtesy
*** 2nd person plural came to be used to show equal status, thus as a courtesy
* You replaced "thou" and "ye" and became 2nd person <u>singular</u>, formal, and
** singular you = addressing one person
** formal you = addressing a person of higher status
** plural you = addressing more than one person
*** often expressed, especially orally as
**** ''all of you''
**** ''y'all''
**** ''you all''
**** ''you guys''
**** ''youse guys'' (New York, Philadelphia dialects)
**** ''you-uns'' or ''yinz'' (Appalachia, Ozarks regions dialects)


== Cases of "you" origins ==
== Cases of "you" origins ==
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*** ''it is yours'' = ''it is thine''
*** ''it is yours'' = ''it is thine''


== Sources ==
=== Sources ===
* [https://allthedifferences.com/thee-vs-thou-vs-thy-vs-ye/ Thee vs. Thou vs. They vs. Ye (The Difference)] (from all the differences.com)
* [https://allthedifferences.com/thee-vs-thou-vs-thy-vs-ye/ Thee vs. Thou vs. They vs. Ye (The Difference)] (from all the differences.com)
* [[wikipedia:You#History|You (wikipedia)]]
* [[wikipedia:You#History|You (wikipedia)]]
* [[wikipedia:Ye_(pronoun)|Ye (wikipedia)]]
* [[wikipedia:Ye_(pronoun)|Ye (wikipedia)]]


== Ye as a definite article ("the") ==
[[Category:Grammar]]
[[Category:Grammar]]
[[Category:Language]]
[[Category:Language]]
[[Category:English Literature]]
[[Category:English Literature]]

Revision as of 19:02, 20 November 2022

Origins and predecessors of the 2nd person pronoun "you" and "yours"

  • thee, thou, thine, thy, ye
  • these "you" forms are from "Middle English"
    • useful for Shakespeare "you" translations
  • "you" and "your/yours" replaced them into the 1600s
    • however, Shakespearean and Biblical texts have traditionally maintained "thee" / "thine"

"You" origins[edit | edit source]

  • Old English origin of "you"
    • from Old English "thou" and "ge"
    • or "ye" (objective case)
  • PIE origin of "you" and "thou"
    • you is from second person plural: *yu
    • thou is from second person singular: *tege- (from which the French and Spanish "tu" is derived)
  • transition from "thee" to "you"
    • in Middle English, the second person plural form merged with the singular
      • 2nd person plural was original used for both plural "you" and out of respect to a superior "(thy")
      • 2nd person plural came to be used to show equal status, thus as a courtesy
  • You replaced "thou" and "ye" and became 2nd person singular, formal, and
    • singular you = addressing one person
    • formal you = addressing a person of higher status
    • plural you = addressing more than one person
      • often expressed, especially orally as
        • all of you
        • y'all
        • you all
        • you guys
        • youse guys (New York, Philadelphia dialects)
        • you-uns or yinz (Appalachia, Ozarks regions dialects)

Cases of "you" origins[edit | edit source]

2nd person case Nominative

(subject)

Indicative

(a command)

Accusative

(also "objective" for direct object)

Dative

(indirect object)

Genetive

(possessive determiner)

Possessive Pronoun Reflexive
singular plural singular plural singular plural singular plural singular plural singular plural
you singular or

plural

you go you [all] go You listen! You [all] listen! he spoke to you he speaks to you [all] he gives you a horse he gives you (all) a horse do it yourself do it yourselves
your / yours singular / plural your book [all] your book yours yours
thou singular subjective (informal) thou goest
thee singular objective he speeketh to thee he givest thee a horse
thy singular possessive thy kingdom doest it thy self
thine singular possessive of words that begin w/ a vowel thine apple thine thine own self
ye plural subjective

(or singular formal)

Ye goeth

or My Lord, ye goeth

Ye listen! Hear ye! youres
  • note: the Wikipedia chart on "Personal Pronouns in Middle English" distinguishes between:
    • thy as "possessive determiner"
      • possessive determiner = indicates possession or belonging
        • I like your shoes
    • and "thine" as "possessive pronoun
      • Yours are as good as mine
    • here, we keep "thine" as possessive determiner if the noun it possesses begins with a vowel, so,
      • "thy" precedes consonant
        • thy kingdom
      • "thine" precedes a noun
        • thine apple
    • "thine" is otherwise, as per Wikipedia, a 2nd person singular possessive pronoun
      • it is yours = it is thine

Sources[edit | edit source]

Ye as a definite article ("the")[edit | edit source]